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  • #16
    Thanks Chris....I just copied and pasted from the PDF the map.
    Then I copied it into word...for those less qualified to work in Acrobat...TD.

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    • #17
      Hey Chris-who you calling a wimp?ha ha, just got back from vacation and checking in.As one of those 12-13 guys on the first weekend I would prefer it if they kept them together-hell throw in the 4wd second driver as well!!.Dosen't bother me one bit-I like the challenge of getting the front regardless of which class the guy in front is in.Also keeps the day a little shorter for those like me that drive back and forth.
      I plan on running the mighty colt on saturday but will likely run in class 2-I owe a certain female a repayment of that kind of tactic's from my 4wd days.(asumes I can get in front of course)

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      • #18
        I don't know who's throwing the stones here. All I know is Chris won't run in class 13 due to a certain car #185. So who's the wimp or should I say wipped?
        "Love thine enemies, it scares the hell out of them"
        "You never have enough gas until you're on fire!" Ken Schrader NSCS

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        • #19
          haha...i'm telling you guys..

          Gimme a car, and i'll run FWD.

          There are a pile of people who say "he's got training wheels, that's easy, he can't drive a "real" car (FWD)"

          riiight...
          Chris
          Old School Motorsports

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          • #20
            Actually the real reason for splitting class 12 & 13 is not that we don't love racing in 30 car fields, it's scoring. It has been a nightmare at best. Splitting the two helps the "volunteer" scorers. If you don't think it's difficult then come see me this weekend and I'll let you score just two races, any size.

            See you in Minden.
            "Love thine enemies, it scares the hell out of them"
            "You never have enough gas until you're on fire!" Ken Schrader NSCS

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            • #21
              12/13

              Crusher, The schedule looks great to me. As long as I get my track time I'm happy.
              See you all tomorrow.
              Perry Iannuzzi
              Past President
              Canadian Automobile Sport Clubs -Ontario Region

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              • #22
                Chris I'm certainly not one of the pile of people who pick on your choice of class,I'm well aware of your abilities behind the wheel.
                Since I've run in fwd rubber and studs along with the 4wd rubber civic I will say that I think the 4wd is truly the more challenging to be fast/consistant and in control than fwd.
                I'm sure their will be people who disagree with me but I've driven them so that gives me some credability I think?.Those that haven't tried 4wd won't really understand all the funky things that they can(sometimes expected-sometimes not) do both on and off the throttle.
                Its too bad you and I can't have a head to head in equal equipment-that would be fun for sure.

                Oh and BTW I kinda think that rwd rubber would be harder than both(more frustrating too me thinks?)

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                • #23
                  i'd love to have a stab at RWD rubber or studs.

                  Yes it's probably frustrating.

                  However..i have been driving karts for the past 5 or so years, and absolutely love running those things in the rain.

                  and i do agree with you. In my mind...FWD is probably the easiest. as i've driven FWD cars on the street, and it really seems like a "point and shoot" kinda thing. Ofcourse, to be fast you should know the principles of LFBraking, and a liberal amount of handbrake.

                  To me...RWD is probably second on the list. For the most part in these cars you know what they are going to do. (get on the gas the back end is gonna come around) type of thing. However, it does warrant consistancy, and "hitting your marks" every lap. They aren't very forgiving, that is forsure. However it is the most frustrating probably, as a little mistake will cost you alot.

                  I know i'm biassed, but i do think that 4wd is probably the hardest to drive fast. But the easiest to drive slowly and putter around. driving a 4wd car, you really need to be on top of things, than in any other car, as you said, it'll do things you expect and things you don't expect. Driving a 4wd is probably in my mind requires the most commitment. You have to be committed to really tossing the car into the corner, and be confident that you have those 4 wheels gripping coming out of the corner.

                  At the end of the day...take someone who is consistantly fast in ANY car, and they are going to fast in anything. It might take a little while to get the intricacies of the different drive configs....But..common...Car Control is Car Control.

                  BTW...driving a fwd car on the street. it's pathetically frustrating. You stand ont he gas and it goes no place...Boring in my mind. Plus..you can't do nice power drifts.
                  Chris
                  Old School Motorsports

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                  • #24
                    Yep I agree-the 4wd really needs to tossed-with the right amount of aggression,but not more-to be quick for sure.I've found that I don't like using the e-brake for anything other than 180's,just seems to slow you down to much or when the ass slides out it pulls the front off line with it and causes more problems then it solved.I prefer to tune with the ballast(although I use relatively little)location and simply tire pressure so that the car does what I expect(most of the time).When running clockwise the first sunday I consistantly had nice long drifts starting from the brake zone(I was leading and braking early being carefull) while going strait untill way way past the apex of turn 1 with no e-brake and fwd on the throttle-yes they can be boring but not always -oh yeah there was a car in the bank at the apex so being precise was real important
                    I too would consider rwd studs(never rwd rubber,certain volvo driver that would just suck the fun out of racing for me)
                    Since Tom Prentice and the rule makers have effectively killed the fwd stud class its either 4wd or rwd,I'd like to take a stab at running with Tony but I wouldn't be able to afford yet another money pit.My corolla might just become a stud car yet-have to see if a spec tire comes up and for what cost or if the current tires will remain.

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                    • #25
                      Tony is catchable...very catchable.

                      Hopefully with both the new stud cars back up this coming weekend they can have a run at them.
                      Chris
                      Old School Motorsports

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                      • #26
                        never rwd rubber,certain volvo driver that would just suck the fun out of racing for me
                        I heard that!
                        sigpic SACEWE!!!
                        Minden House, S/\Ctionizer
                        Car #24

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                        • #27
                          You were kinda supposed to there Angus,I'haven't been watching to much but you do seem to have calmed down a little

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                          • #28
                            Oh Angus,I just read your account for the first time of our encounter in 2001,more than a little fictous on your part to be sure.
                            Kinda funny how I could hit you from behind on the strait and yet I nearly roll the car over the track exit in 3rd gear(this was because I was actually passing you on the outside since you were travelling down the center and then decided to turn right and plant me into the bank,intentional or just simply unware of whats going on around you?).
                            After that I didn't even touch your car untill the exit of the sweeper despite all your very very animated gestures and slowing down to do so,it was obvious by you giving me the bird with BOTH hands that you weren't interested in driving your car anymore.I could hve spun you out a 1/2 dozen times thru that corner but didn't despite the fact you weren't even close to another car in your class and I was the leader of my class with 2nd closing because of all your foolishness.
                            I simply waited untill you were heading strait and then I showed you what a real driver can do thru the kink(with a nice easy single contact,not repeated bashing as stated)-you seemed kinda frightened by the extra speed with all your arm waving!(amazing what 7500rpm honda power feels like eh?)
                            And yes you did hit me very hard in turn 5 after that,there also were no other cars around as at all thru this whole thing and I was in perfect control of my car when you decided to drive thru it.I knew you would so I did not throw it into the corner as I normally would to have you punt my driver door.
                            I'm big enough to admit when I make mistake's and I'm usually first to arrive in that person's pit when I do foul up-I was in the right and you simply fail to accept that you were the cause of the entire incident.
                            Have a look at the pics of your green wagon-then compare the amount of dents to my honda wagon-notice anything different?.
                            This isn't a rehash,although it has been the single ugliest moment I've had in racing both during and the disgusting stuff that happened after.
                            Like I said earlier,you have seemed to have cleaned up a bit and that is progress.

                            Oh and as to your official protest of my driving-the official actually apologized for having to drop me one finishing position.Said that if I hadn't told him that I did help you get up to speed thru the kink I wouldn't have been penilized-so basically if I'd followed your lead and embelished the story I'd been ok.

                            Still not likely to spend anytime in RWD rubber anytime soon however.

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                            • #29
                              A ha ha ha!!
                              Don't forget to wipe after all that!

                              Still not likely to spend anytime in RWD rubber anytime soon however
                              And we are all thankful.
                              Keep readin' the SACnews, it'll help keep you regular
                              sigpic SACEWE!!!
                              Minden House, S/\Ctionizer
                              Car #24

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                              • #30
                                Hey Everybody,
                                In regards to the 4wd discussion, I figured I would like to put in my two cents. Since this is my rookie year, along with the three other drivers that drive the black 4wd Celica, we are all finding out that 4wd is definitely not point and shoot. I have found that there is a real art to being able to get the car pointed where you want, not like in a road car where you brake, turn, gas it. I am finally getting used to the feeling of letting the car rotate to point in the right direction before giving it gas in hard turns, and using the throttle to set a drift in the kink. I have also learned that if your going to let off of the gas in a 4wd, you better know where your front wheels are pointed (good thing snow banks are soft). By the third weekend, I thought I was beginning to figure things out, when I managed to actually finish in a respectable third, but by the fourth weekend, it was back to square one. With most of our races coming long after the studs, the track was pretty polished. I spent most of Saturday hanging out with the RWD guys, and getting beat by them to boot. It wasn't until I tagged along for my Dad's last race that I saw that slower is sometimes faster. Coming out of the last turn, he slowly got on the gas, making sure the tire didn't spin, and I watched him pull away from a tire spinning Subaru. I tried applying this in my last race, and wouldn't you know, I kept up to the field! I figure that it doesn't matter what all wheel drive car you have, if you can't drive it, you won't be any faster than the guys who have power at only two wheels. Trust me.
                                Andrew Vernon -#181
                                1986 MR2 - (spinning out in a race near you)
                                1989 All-Trac - (on sabbatical)

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