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Solo 1 Scoring & Classification Proposal

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  • ScotcH
    replied
    Re: Solo 1 Scoring & Classification Proposal

    Originally posted by lowrider View Post
    If Arek can get me those pip schedules I will reclassify everyone from top to bottom with a 7.5 pip spread if there is enough interest.
    I can get you a list of all the PIP totals for each competitor ... you don't need the breakdown of mods I assume, just the totals, yes? I'll try to get it tonight, but can't promise anything. In fact, I'll post the list here so anyone else is free to play around with the numbers

    Leave a comment:


  • lowrider
    replied
    Re: Solo 1 Scoring & Classification Proposal

    Originally posted by thgear View Post
    you could ask Arek for all those..

    you could also ask all the competitors for their mods list

    you could technicaly get everyones contact information from Ana...

    If Arek can get me those pip schedules I will reclassify everyone from top to bottom with a 7.5 pip spread if there is enough interest.

    Leave a comment:


  • thgear
    replied
    Re: Solo 1 Scoring & Classification Proposal

    Originally posted by lowrider View Post
    OK...!!! I will reclassify everyone from 2007 just to see what the classes would look like but I will need someone to furnish me with pip schedules for all of the competitors.
    you could ask Arek for all those..

    you could also ask all the competitors for their mods list

    you could technicaly get everyones contact information from Ana...

    Leave a comment:


  • lowrider
    replied
    Re: Solo 1 Scoring & Classification Proposal

    Originally posted by thgear View Post
    why dont you go and reclass everyone and then show us the results....
    OK...!!! I will reclassify everyone from 2007 just to see what the classes would look like but I will need someone to furnish me with pip schedules for all of the competitors.

    Leave a comment:


  • ScotcH
    replied
    Re: Solo 1 Scoring & Classification Proposal

    Originally posted by lowrider View Post
    Yes, this is very true. It seems overwhelming.
    Well, yes, but we've managed it pretty well in recent years! You can't arguee that the competition has not been close in most classes! We didn't have any runaway winners, and for the most part, people are happy with how their cars faired against others. This of course does not eman that changes and suggestions will not be heard, but they need to be for the right reasons, with supporting data and results to show how the changes will affect the sport!

    Leave a comment:


  • lowrider
    replied
    Re: Solo 1 Scoring & Classification Proposal

    Originally posted by thgear View Post
    ...considering the amount of different cars out there, you can see how getting it all together is hard.
    Yes, this is very true. It seems overwhelming.

    Leave a comment:


  • thgear
    replied
    Re: Solo 1 Scoring & Classification Proposal

    Originally posted by lowrider View Post
    It seems to me that a lot of these scoring issues are the result of trying to maintain too many classes. Couldn't we expand the classes to a pip range of say 7.5 instead of the current 5 pip spread?
    why dont you go and reclass everyone and then show us the results....

    Leave a comment:


  • thgear
    replied
    Re: Solo 1 Scoring & Classification Proposal

    then you get too many underfilled classes....

    the problem goes back to your argument againt "all the racing series"

    usualy, in racing, you have a series, and you have rules, competitiors can either build their cars under the rules, or they can take a walk, end of story.

    solosprint promotes the idea that you can bring ANY car to the track and DO WELL, IF your DRIVING SKILL is top notch

    (Jason, this is where our percpetion of the series objectives differ) Having an "optimized" car should only throw you up a couple of classes, and so the deciding factor should still only be the personal skill level of the driver.

    considering the amount of different cars out there, you can see how getting it all together is hard.

    Leave a comment:


  • lowrider
    replied
    Re: Solo 1 Scoring & Classification Proposal

    It seems to me that a lot of these scoring issues are the result of trying to maintain too many classes. Couldn't we expand the classes to a pip range of say 7.5 instead of the current 5 pip spread?

    Leave a comment:


  • thgear
    replied
    Re: Solo 1 Scoring & Classification Proposal

    Originally posted by Slowpoke View Post

    If I were in an underfilled Touring class and the overall meant something to me, I'd try to form a "Touring Club" so that maybe some T3 guys compete in T2, and maybe a T1 guy takes off a swaybar to move down to T2... but so that you always have competition. That's not an option that Modified guys at the other end of the scale typically have, though. The class I chose to prep for was based on a lot of factors...

    #1: Fun to drive
    #2: Economically sustainable (in 2006 it was, anyway. )
    #3: Good Competition
    #4: Spread of club members in different classes.

    Things seem to keep changing (or being proposed) that push me closer and closer to SGT1, where I really don't want to be.
    .
    the underlying "spirit" of the sport should be fun for everyone regardless of anything (except maybe tires and brakes)

    if i have to "choose a class to have fun", thats already going off tangent from the "spirit" of the series.

    Originally posted by Slowpoke View Post
    If what you are only interested is a fight in your own class, then getting propositioned is not a huge problem; it doesn't affect the placement order within your own class.
    it does in the following scenario, you got 3 drivers in your class, A, B and C

    driver A and B always have a rivavlry going, two events in a row driver A could not make it, and during those two days you get your ass handed to you from driver Z from a class below and you score shitty points

    or worse yet, with only 2 drivers, you are now stuck against pax, and you score shitty points again, then when driver A returns, he goes back to kicking your ass, even if on average driver A never beats pax him/herself

    Leave a comment:


  • Slowpoke
    replied
    Re: Solo 1 Scoring & Classification Proposal

    Originally posted by thgear View Post
    i just did a quick glance over the Event 9 results and the ones that i chewed up through pax.

    the top 3 finishers did not even beat pax! only 4 of the top 10 finishers beat pax, and not even by much.
    Well, if the top three drivers in the series from three drifferent classes didn't beat PAX, then I think that IS a reason to revisit it the PAX Factors.

    Originally posted by thgear View Post
    what is wrong, is forcing someone to fight pax, while everyone else just fends off in their own class.
    If I were in an underfilled Touring class and the overall meant something to me, I'd try to form a "Touring Club" so that maybe some T3 guys compete in T2, and maybe a T1 guy takes off a swaybar to move down to T2... but so that you always have competition. That's not an option that Modified guys at the other end of the scale typically have, though. The class I chose to prep for was based on a lot of factors...

    #1: Fun to drive
    #2: Economically sustainable (in 2006 it was, anyway. )
    #3: Good Competition
    #4: Spread of club members in different classes.

    Things seem to keep changing (or being proposed) that push me closer and closer to SGT1, where I really don't want to be.


    Originally posted by thgear View Post
    i came here expecting a fight in my own class (what everyone keeps defending) and another class totaly ruins my fun... well thats not very nice.
    If what you are only interested is a fight in your own class, then getting propositioned is not a huge problem; it doesn't affect the placement order within your own class.

    Leave a comment:


  • ScotcH
    replied
    Re: Solo 1 Scoring & Classification Proposal

    That's why I liked when James scored everyone against iPAX last year (for fun). The results were close, and didn't depend on how many people were in the classes ... everyone was scored against PAX, even the class winners with full classes. Definitely seemed pretty fair to me, as fas as an overall score is concerned.

    Leave a comment:


  • thgear
    replied
    Re: Solo 1 Scoring & Classification Proposal

    Originally posted by jason_alt View Post
    I fail to see much of a problem here. If you've somewhat optimized your car for the class you're in ( brakes, tires and suspension ) and honed your skills like the 'best drivers' have over the years, then beating pax should be attainable. I admit you have to fight for it, but it can be done. I think it's a fair and accurate representation of how someone is performing compared to the fast guys. I can't stress enough that to be competitive, a driver HAS to optimize their vehicle, but more importantly, their skillset. Maybe the pax modifiers could be looked at just a little more closely, but then again i'm not so sure.
    nothing wrong with pax

    what is wrong, is forcing someone to fight pax, while everyone else just fends off in their own class.

    i just did a quick glance over the Event 9 results and the ones that i chewed up through pax.

    the top 3 finishers did not even beat pax! only 4 of the top 10 finishers beat pax, and not even by much.

    which is perfectly fine if EVERYONE was measured up against the same ruler.


    Originally posted by jason_alt View Post
    Maybe the class being propositioned shouldn't be 'punished' and scored the way it currently is. Maybe a proposition could be better defined as one who beats the pax value of the above class. In that case, it really shows you're handing it to the competition, and could be a better way to collect statistical information in order to fine tune the system, especially in the lower classes.

    People cannot expect to bring average skills and an average car to the track and expect to take home a trophy. I think the current scoring system truly rewards those who have worked hard on building up their driving skills and optimally set-up their vehicles for its respective class.
    it does, but its just that some of the people who are vouching against my proposed idea keep taling about "class victories, and class wars" and so forth.

    when the fact of the matter if i come 2nd place in my class by 1%, but the guy from a class below propositions my class, all of a sudden my 2nd place finish of 1% turns into a 3rd place at 5%!

    i came here expecting a fight in my own class (what everyone keeps defending) and another class totaly ruins my fun... well thats not very nice.

    Leave a comment:


  • jason_alt
    replied
    Re: Solo 1 Scoring & Classification Proposal

    Originally posted by thgear View Post
    happy? HA


    my current issues with the current rule set:

    scoring:

    - people without a full class get stuck with PAX, creating a fictious opponent who's experience is the combined average of all the best drivers of all the other classes! its like taking Avi, Chris and Dave and mixing them all into one...
    I fail to see much of a problem here. If you've somewhat optimized your car for the class you're in ( brakes, tires and suspension ) and honed your skills like the 'best drivers' have over the years, then beating pax should be attainable. I admit you have to fight for it, but it can be done. I think it's a fair and accurate representation of how someone is performing compared to the fast guys. I can't stress enough that to be competitive, a driver HAS to optimize their vehicle, but more importantly, their skillset. Maybe the pax modifiers could be looked at just a little more closely, but then again i'm not so sure.

    Originally posted by thgear View Post
    propositioning, when soemone propositions another class, that class gets mixed in with the new class, and if you have enough people there then the points get skewed again
    Maybe the class being propositioned shouldn't be 'punished' and scored the way it currently is. Maybe a proposition could be better defined as one who beats the pax value of the above class. In that case, it really shows you're handing it to the competition, and could be a better way to collect statistical information in order to fine tune the system, especially in the lower classes.

    People cannot expect to bring average skills and an average car to the track and expect to take home a trophy. I think the current scoring system truly rewards those who work hard to build up their driving skills, closely familiarize themself with the track they compete on and optimally set-up their vehicles for its respective class.

    Leave a comment:


  • Steve2
    replied
    Re: Solo 1 Scoring & Classification Proposal

    I think you are losing the spirit of "solo" - this is, plain and simple, time trials, and is different than "racing" in that sense.

    If you are 2nd because the best driver in the series is in your class, you get screwed every event. What if you are the only driver in your class? 10 pts each event? Or there are 3 or 4 drivers, but other classes have 12, where it is way harder to be competitive.

    Also, rewarding consistency like that means the best/fastest guy would get screwed if they are pushing hard and have one 4-wheels-off session. no consistency points for that day means they could ftd every event, kill their class, and lose the series.

    Also, your AWD vs. 2WD class system, not considering suspension and other mods, makes no sense, to me at least.

    Not trying to hate here - good on ya for proposing SOMETHING, but don't get upset if people just plain don't agree with you.


    Edit: just realized, I posted after reading only page 1... lots of my points were already brought up.

    Leave a comment:

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