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  • Chris P
    replied
    Re: Layout changes?

    Originally posted by SmokeScreen
    Wow, I am surprised too. A 2006 BMW 330i is RWD and has a suspension index of 70, a 2006 330xi is the same car in AWD, same hp and a bit heavier (210lbs) and has a suspension index of 70, both cars starting class is GT2. I am no expert, but that does not seem right.

    Just how good do you think that BMW AWD system really is in an asphalt track environment, not all AWD systems are creating equal. I'd take the 330i with a LSD myself.

    Leave a comment:


  • jonweir
    replied
    Re: Layout changes?

    Originally posted by ADAM View Post
    correct..

    it would be like claiming the extra weight of a V8...but somehow we forgot that....gee wizz it produces more power...

    or in this case... we claim the wieght of the AWD system...but forget that having another set of wheels powered...is a huge advantage...especially when you get more power
    Come on Adam, less whining and more driving. Did you come out to a single event last year?

    Leave a comment:


  • bsclywilly
    replied
    Re: Layout changes?

    Originally posted by Mr_Efficiency View Post
    The car is an 86 crx. I was plaing on using a crv trans and complete rear subframe. I know the crv doesnt put much power to the rear wheels and is fwd most of the time, but the way the system works all that is easily modified.
    But I dont want to get into that here.

    I have to get on reading/memorizing your rule book so I can keep up with this. Maybe I should have kept this to myself until after the new rules were set in stone so this stayed over looked, lol :P
    Don't worry, _E. It's normal for us to discuss things to no end on these forums.

    Leave a comment:


  • Carguy
    replied
    Re: Layout changes?

    Originally posted by ADAM View Post
    "Same 3 series platform but each model would have a different HI."

    Ahhhh Pierre..my frech friend..that is the crux of the issue...

    we do not differenciate between the same car and that car having FWD and a AWD varient by changing the handling index

    so we dont assign any benifit to various drivetrain layouts..which makes no sense

    thats my point
    Just doing my bit to aid and abet Adam

    Leave a comment:


  • Mr_Efficiency
    replied
    Re: Layout changes?

    The car is an 86 crx. I was plaing on using a crv trans and complete rear subframe. I know the crv doesnt put much power to the rear wheels and is fwd most of the time, but the way the system works all that is easily modified.
    But I dont want to get into that here.

    I have to get on reading/memorizing your rule book so I can keep up with this. Maybe I should have kept this to myself until after the new rules were set in stone so this stayed over looked, lol :P

    Leave a comment:


  • ADAM
    replied
    Re: Layout changes?

    correct..

    it would be like claiming the extra weight of a V8...but somehow we forgot that....gee wizz it produces more power...

    or in this case... we claim the wieght of the AWD system...but forget that having another set of wheels powered...is a huge advantage...especially when you get more power

    Leave a comment:


  • ADAM
    replied
    Re: Layout changes?

    so my point was.... why should any car be moved from its base class by installing a AWD system in that car?

    when our rules say it does not effect the cars handling...nor has any PIP advantage...

    we have a break in logic here

    Leave a comment:


  • ADAM
    replied
    Re: Layout changes?

    BINGO!!!!!

    now you see what I have been saying for the past few years....

    AWD cars have an distinct advantage in our series..for the very simple reason...

    they get to claim the weight of the AWD system...however are not taking ANY pips for having it...

    any anyone who says...AWD is not an advantage has rocks on thier head...

    every other race series breaks out AWD cars from FWD and RWD...that should tell us that they have an advantage (we obviously know they do as well)

    Leave a comment:


  • ADAM
    replied
    Re: Layout changes?

    NO NO

    former CCC member...

    100% current and up to date shit disturber

    Leave a comment:


  • 13inches
    replied
    Re: Layout changes?

    I'm very confused right now. Perhaps it is my interpretation that is incorrect, but I'm hoping that I've read this properly and it is simply turning out that what I have read is not actually true.





















    The way I read it, Adam's signature states that he is a former shit disturber.
    Last edited by 13inches; 02-24-2011, 10:46 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • ADAM
    replied
    Re: Layout changes?

    "Same 3 series platform but each model would have a different HI."

    Ahhhh Pierre..my frech friend..that is the crux of the issue...

    we do not differenciate between the same car and that car having FWD and a AWD varient by changing the handling index

    so we dont assign any benifit to various drivetrain layouts..which makes no sense

    thats my point

    Leave a comment:


  • Carguy
    replied
    Re: Layout changes?

    I wonder if there is a production AWD equivalent to your modified car. For instance, a BMW 3 series may have a RWD setup or and AWD setup (X-drive I think it's called). Same 3 series platform but each model would have a different HI. Depending on your car's original base PI it may me "outclassed" in Open Mod. What is the base vehicle? And what are the other modifications?

    Leave a comment:


  • bsclywilly
    replied
    Re: Layout changes?

    Originally posted by ADAM View Post
    "In the 2010 Rule book (see link in my sig), non production drivetrain layout is covered under rule 4.9.2. Technically by the rulebook, you would be placed in Open Mod and would have to meet all the safety requirements for open mod"


    Will,

    why would a drivetrain layout change put you in MOD when the current rules dont even account for drivetrain configuration in OEM cars?
    It's not MOD. It's Open Mod (UNLTD). And as the name implies, it accounts for the unaccountable (i.e. open ended), such as non-production vehicles or vehicles that have been radically modified. Why do you ask when you were around and part of the CCC when this got put into the rule book?

    And the HI accounts for drivetrain configuration...

    Leave a comment:


  • thgear
    replied
    Re: Layout changes?

    Originally posted by kmorris View Post
    So what is the difference between Open Mod and Unlimited? Does this mean that production-based cars beyond a certain PIP count go in there too, instead of just non-production cars?

    Or does it mean anything goes, like NOS, rockets, nitro, 6 wheels?

    <>
    It is only a name change, all the rules still apply.

    Leave a comment:


  • kmorris
    replied
    Re: Layout changes?

    Originally posted by bsclywilly View Post
    And the new name for Open mod class is now 'Unlimited'.
    So what is the difference between Open Mod and Unlimited? Does this mean that production-based cars beyond a certain PIP count go in there too, instead of just non-production cars?

    Or does it mean anything goes, like NOS, rockets, nitro, 6 wheels?

    <>

    Leave a comment:

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